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Just want to hear everyone's point of view on the Obama vs McCain issue. I ... Stackers' Lounge forum

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    lucky13mt's Avatar
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    Thumbs up Stackers' Presidential Debate Thread

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    Just want to hear everyone's point of view on the Obama vs McCain issue. I thought it would be interesting to have a little debate amongst Stackers.

    I know a lot of you probably have a whole lot to say on this.

    Lets keep it clean and non-aggressive (or not too aggressive lol).

    Let the debating begin .
    Last edited by lucky13mt; 06-11-2008 at 10:17 AM.
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    Cool. Again, Obama's accomplishments. Not what he says he will do, what he can show he's done. Businesses created, military achievements, payrolls met, taxes paid, etc. I'm sure he was a wonderful community activist. But that makes you worthy of commander in chief?

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    I just wish romney got the nomination. He would have won by a landslide against obama.


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    This country is screwed I'm afraid. When you have congress wanting a windfall profits tax on oil companies, watch out. They are too dumb to see that those taxes are passed onto us consumers, RAISING gas prices. Corporations don't pay taxes, we consumers do. They are pandering to the dumb masses.

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    It much the same here in Ireland but I do think they know the cost is passed on to the normal person, they just don't care as they are not paying for it.

    Quote Originally Posted by cabinets View Post
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    This country is screwed I'm afraid. When you have congress wanting a windfall profits tax on oil companies, watch out. They are too dumb to see that those taxes are passed onto us consumers, RAISING gas prices. Corporations don't pay taxes, we consumers do. They are pandering to the dumb masses.

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    j llama's Avatar
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    I am voting Iron Man for President.
    lol
    I prefer Obama over McCain personally.

    However, once I heard that Obama secretly met with Clinton at Bilderburg last week, i felt this was a reason for concern. We need a change in a different direction all together, as I feel McCain wants to keep us in Iraq for many many years.

    "U.S. military presence in the country expires later this year. Iraqi critics complain that the agreement proposed by the United States would turn Iraq into a virtual colony and allow the United States to maintain nearly 60 bases in their country indefinitely." (Washington Post Wednesday, June 11, 2008; 9:12 AM)

    What Bush said:
    MESEBERG, Germany, June 11 (Reuters) - U.S. President George W. Bush said on Wednesday he expects to seal a security pact with Iraq but added there were no plans for permanent U.S. bases there.

    Basically anything that comes out of the current administration, I think the opposite is usually the truth.

    Here is the truth behind said agreement.
    Iraq SOFA (Status of Forces Agreement) deal allows future wars.
    The proposed Iraq-US security treaty includes classified articles that would give US the right to attack other nations from Iraqi soil.
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    j llama's Avatar
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    On a side note, Obama has a BlackBerry
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    A BBC investigation estimates that around $23 billion may have been lost, stolen or just not properly accounted for in Iraq.
    For the first time, the extent to which some private contractors have profited from the conflict and rebuilding has been researched by the BBC's Panorama using US and Iraqi government sources.
    A US gagging order is preventing discussion of the allegations.
    The order applies to 70 court cases against some of the top US companies.
    War profiteering
    While George Bush remains in the White House, it is unlikely the gagging orders will be lifted. To date, no major US contractor faces trial for fraud or mismanagement in Iraq. The president's Democratic opponents are keeping up the pressure over war profiteering in Iraq. Henry Waxman who chairs the House Committee on Oversight and Government Reform said: "The money that's gone into waste, fraud and abuse under these contracts is just so outrageous, its egregious. "It may well turn out to be the largest war profiteering in history."
    ++++
    Really makes me want to run out and vote for a Republican predecessor
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    Do you really think McCain is the same character of man as Bush, simply because he's a Republican?

    Honestly, I don't like any of the Candidates. The vetting process the media puts Candidates through nowadays virtually assures us that no one will ever run who has any strength of character, vision, wisdom, or ability to lead this country. If they have any of those qualities, they're running a major corporation and getting paid 5 times as much money. With 1% of the scrutiny and stress of running for and becoming President.

    McCain is the best candidate left to run this country. Unfortunately, he should have been President 20 years ago, right after Reagan.

    Obama has the charisma and the ability to energize. But his economic ideas will crush our economy. His class warfare statements should truly frighten even the most average voter.

    We need a true Libertarian candidate, with a legitimate shot of winning.
    If I knew where I was going, I might already be there. -- Cross Canadian Ragweed.

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    Quote Originally Posted by vince1 View Post
    I think they know the cost is passed on to the normal person, they just don't care as they are not paying for it.
    DING! You win the prize!

    Thats why their pensions are completely taxpayer funded, (while we have to use our own money to fund a 401-k) and they are 100% vested in their retirement at 100% salary after 1 term in office (I want $195,000/year for life just for pulling a 2-6 year job, too!).

    Oh yeah, they don't participate in Social Security (read: pay 15% FICA taxes on their incomes like we do) and don't participate in Medicare, either.

    So yeah, when they're talking about "representing" us, their lips are just moving. They're in a pampered, out of touch, aristocratic class of ne'erdowells that would make our founding fathers shoot them on sight.
    If I knew where I was going, I might already be there. -- Cross Canadian Ragweed.

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    I don't believe that either candidate is electable. I do know that I am NOT voting for Obama. I find it difficult to vote someone President, that was a member of a church that preaches negativity about this country, military and governement.

    He speaks of change. What change specifically. Not all change is good. He could mean that he is going to turn this democracy into a socialist state. That's not good. He is running on the universal heathcare ticket, but there is NO WAY that this country can support universal healthcare.

    He also said that the first thing that he is going to do once he gets in office is raise taxes. Does anyone here think that raising taxes is going to get us out of this economic slowdown? I dont think so.

    So instead of beliveing the rhetoric that Obama is spewing, do a little due diligence and see that all he is a sly taking. socialist that has not idea what he is doing.

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    j llama's Avatar
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    [quote=LaTuFu]
    We need a true Libertarian candidate, with a legitimate shot of winning. [quote]

    A Libertarian can shake things up. It's sad that Ron Paul is being almost ignored by mainstream media these days. Very unfortunate he doesn't really stand a chance as a third party candidate against McCainbot and Obama. He has a decent following of grassroots supporters, although its more of a proof of concept idea at this point. The mass public just isn't ready to vote for someone they have to actually do some reaserch on, instead of what is spoon fed to them by the media.

    Washington Post Wednesday, June 11, 2008; Page A04
    McCain Camp Distorts Obama's Tax Policies, Exaggerates Their Adverse Impact

    [quote=LaTuFu;764957]Do you really think McCain is the same character of man as Bush, simply because he's a Republican?[quote]

    One word sums it up...YES
    McCain On When Troops Can Come Home From Iraq: ‘That’s Not Too Important’»
    In an interview on NBC’s Today Show, host Matt Lauer asked Sen. John McCain (R-AZ) about his support for the war in Iraq. Noting that violence has decreased in Iraq, Lauer asked if McCain has a better “estimate” of when he would withdraw troops from the country. “No, but that’s not too important,” McCain responded:

    Q: A lot of people now say the surge is working.
    McCAIN: Anyone who knows the facts on the ground say that.
    Q: If it’s working, senator, do you now have a better estimate of when American forces can come home from Iraq?
    McCAIN: No, but that’s not too important. What’s important is the casualties in Iraq. Americans are in South Korea. Americans are in Japan. American troops are in Germany. That’s all fine.

    +++++++++++++++++
    McCain: ‘I Dont Think Americans Are Concerned’ If We Stay In Iraq For ‘10,000 Years’»

    Last week, Sen. John McCain (R-AZ) said it “would be fine with” him if the U.S. military stayed in Iraq for “a hundred years” or even a “million years.”
    Fifty-nine percent say the U.S. should “stick to a withdrawal timetable” instead of keeping “a significant number of troops in Iraq until the situation there gets better, even if that takes many years.”
    But on CBS’s Face the Nation, McCain claimed that Americans would not be “concerned” if the U.S. spends “10,000 years” in Iraq:

    MCain: "The point is it’s American casualties. We’ve go to get American’s off the frontlines, have the Iraqis as part of the strategy, take over more and more of the responsibilities, and then I don’t think Americans are concerned if we’re there for one hundred years or a thousand years or ten thousand years"
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    j llama's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by deepdish View Post
    He speaks of change. What change specifically. Not all change is good. He could mean that he is going to turn this democracy into a socialist state.

    So instead of beliveing the rhetoric that Obama is spewing, do a little due diligence and see that all he is a sly taking. socialist that has not idea what he is doing.
    You sir, have been spoon fed.
    ++
    Right slams Obama as 'shady Chicago socialist'
    February 17, 2008
    http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/new...cle3382313.ece
    "Leading Republicans believe they can trounce Barack Obama in the presidential election by tarring him as a shady Chicago socialist. They are increasingly confident that his campaign could collapse by the time their attack machine has finished with him"
    ++

    I am probably going to make people mad on all four sides in this thread.
    I enjoy debate.

    BTW, why is Universal Healthcare bad? There are millions of people in this country that cannot afford healthcare.

    Comparing Canada and USA healthcare.
    "Studies have come to different conclusions about the result of this disparity in spending. A 2007 review of all studies comparing health outcomes in Canada and the U.S., in a Canadian peer-reviewed medical journal, found that "health outcomes may be superior in patients cared for in Canada versus the United States, but differences are not consistent."[7] Life expectancy is longer in Canada, and its infant mortality rate is lower than that of the U.S"

    Through all entities in its public-private system, the U.S. spends more per capita than any other nation in the world,[11] but is the only wealthy industrialized country in the world that lacks some form of universal health care.[12]
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    phatmanxxl's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by j llama View Post
    You sir, have been spoon fed.

    BTW, why is Universal Healthcare bad? There are millions of people in this country that cannot afford healthcare.
    why dont you go to your public aid department and get the medical card for a year and tell me how much you like going to the VNA? Thats what our heath care will turn into let government take it over.

    anybody can jump on the state sponsered healtcare if they wanted to, but you have to deal with somebody in the bureau to make your decisions for you, weather or not you need the medical attention and weather or not they are going to pay for it. Sir, id rather me and my doctor make my health decions, than some government department 200 miles away.
    Last edited by phatmanxxl; 06-11-2008 at 03:00 PM.

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    j llama's Avatar
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    Ok, so maybe the healthcare debate isn't as fun as the War debate.

    hmph
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