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Again, this all depends on YOUR COMPANY'S IT POLICY. Just because one company chooses not ... General Blackberry forum

  1. #16
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    Re: Is it possible to use BES and still get POP3 email?

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    Again, this all depends on YOUR COMPANY'S IT POLICY. Just because one company chooses not to monitor activity, does not mean that it cannot be done and is not done. You are much better off assuming that NOTHING is private on the machine, because the technology does exist to monitor that traffic.

    The tech support guys that I am friends with have made similar statements to jgold's buddy. However they are quick to point out that it is because in order to do this type of monitoring, it places additional workload on the IT support guys. So in practice, with the companies that I am familiar with, they do not monitor individual usage on a micro basis--unless you give them a reason. They do have filters/monitors in place that will alert IT to a pattern of usage. If you give them enough of a reason, they can start watching. Caveat Emptor.
    If I knew where I was going, I might already be there. -- Cross Canadian Ragweed.

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    Re: Is it possible to use BES and still get POP3 email?

    (sits back and wonders how confused he will get about what can and can't be done with an IT policy when this topic is finished)

    Zo

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    Re: Is it possible to use BES and still get POP3 email?

    Thats why I wonder how BES questions can ever get answered in a forum. If you aren't a BES admin asking a technical question, its practically a hypothetical question symposium.
    If I knew where I was going, I might already be there. -- Cross Canadian Ragweed.

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    Re: Is it possible to use BES and still get POP3 email?

    Ok, well is there a program that masks SMS messages or routes them the traditional way instead? My IT policy appears to be pretty lax as well, given that I can install anything I want, but I just would prefer to keep the SMS messages private!

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    Re: Is it possible to use BES and still get POP3 email?

    Quote Originally Posted by LaTuFu
    Thats why I wonder how BES questions can ever get answered in a forum. If you aren't a BES admin asking a technical question, its practically a hypothetical question symposium.

    I totally understand where you are coming from with that, however I am asking a very specific "can" or "cant" type of question. It appears from the responses I am getting that the answer in this case is "can", but "not necessarily"!


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    Re: Is it possible to use BES and still get POP3 email?

    http://www.blackberry.com/knowledgec...39948&vernum=0

    Rim's reference guide to IT policies. I don't doubt that this is not a complete list of what an IT policy can do but a reference guide to the most common used items in an IT policy. As LaTuFu said, asking an IT policy question in here without actually being a BES admin ends up being hypothetical in all answers. I took BES training for sales purposes and am finding out new things that can be done all the time with the folks in here.

    Zo

    Edit: Forgot to mention that the above link opens a PDF file from Rim.

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    Re: Is it possible to use BES and still get POP3 email?

    I guess my next question is are the policies a "mix and match" type setup, or is it "all or nothing"? What I mean is, is it possible that an IT group can have a (lack of) policy so that you can install anything, yet at the same time be logging SMS messages?

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    Re: Is it possible to use BES and still get POP3 email?

    Again, I am not a bes admin or user but, as I understand the above document from Rim, it is a mix and match except on certain items (such as password timeout, etc).

    Zo
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    Re: Is it possible to use BES and still get POP3 email?

    Well my next move will be to simply call RIM and get clarification as to what can be done I suppose. Assuming they verify that logging is potentially in place, I will figure out a "nice" way of asking someone in IT what the deal is.

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    Lightbulb Re: Is it possible to use BES and still get POP3 email?

    There's a few different ways that your BES policy administrator could have you set up, which would affect these things. The connection to the carrier, and through the carrier's browser, is basically a VPN. As long as your traffic is going through that route, it can't be viewed/seen by your BES admin... there are a few tricks here, though, because typically the device is routing most of its traffic through the MDS / BES. You can play around with this (depending on policies) by changing your "browser push" settings to default, unless you're blocked from this.

    Here's the big one though - Much of this depends on the BES server version. We've just switched to 4.1, and here are some new things:

    1.) A policy can very easily be assigned which sync's your PIN and SMS messages back to the server. This means that even though those messages are going through RIM and your carrier's network's respectively, the device can be configured via policy to SYNC THE PIN/SMS DATA BACK to the BES. Basically when the message hits your device, the device is sending a copy to the BES. It's called PIN/SMS logging. Your phone call logs are typically tracked as a default policy, btw.

    2.) It's very easy to pick and choose policies, in response to Wifi4Milez question. Also, just like on a LAN domain, there can even be multiple groups (example, managers may have different rights than the worker bees, etc.). This means the policy applied to your device could be much different than others in your organization. You can even be seemlesly moved into a different group without your knowledge, one which may have policies in place like those above to log your messages (for all you conspiracy theorists out there).

    I'm just starting to dig around into some of the more advanced policies, but the available policies have definitely become much more robust with each BES version.

    The bottom line is, if you're on a BES, the user settings are ALWAYS overridden by the server and its policies, whether you like it or not, and the device can be programmed to do some pretty cool tricks all on its own from inside your pocket--completely unbeknownst to you as you skip down the street.

    Moral of the story? Be nice to your BES admins.
    Last edited by PwDiamond; 07-27-2007 at 03:09 AM.

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    Re: Is it possible to use BES and still get POP3 email?

    Quote Originally Posted by PwDiamond
    There's a few different ways that your BES policy administrator could have you set up, which would affect these things. The connection to the carrier, and through the carrier's browser, is basically a VPN. As long as your traffic is going through that route, it can't be viewed/seen by your BES admin... there are a few tricks here, though, because typically the device is routing most of its traffic through the MDS / BES. You can play around with this (depending on policies) by changing your "browser push" settings to default, unless you're blocked from this.
    Based on what you just said, I checked my browser settings and "enable push", "enbable MDS push", and "enable wap push" are all checked. Are these the default settings, or does this mean they are checking me out!

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    Re: Is it possible to use BES and still get POP3 email?

    Quote Originally Posted by wifi4milez
    ~via BB (wap.pinstack.com)~
    So does this mean all my SMS messages are visible to corporate/IT department?
    Please carefully re-read what I wrote as I have carefully seleted my wording:
    Quote Originally Posted by takeshi
    Also, be aware that nothing on a company BES-connected BB should be considered private -- regardless of the delivery method of the content to the BB.
    Your BES admin might be pretty lax but he does have access if it comes down to it. Whether or not that's an acceptable risk is your judgment call. "Do you want your personal data submitted to a court if your company is subpoenaed?" is how I tend to look at it. Not all companies shred documents and delete email/content and backups when this sort of thing happens...

    Also, I'd like to point out that it was just a few years ago that everyone (BES admins included) thought that PIN messages were totally private and could not be logged/viewed by the BES admin. The Canadian Bank story definitely demonstrated how mistaken people were. I tend to play on the safe side given that "common knowledge" could very well be proven wrong down the road. YMMV with your approach to privacy.
    Last edited by takeshi; 07-27-2007 at 12:42 PM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by wifi4milez
    Based on what you just said, I checked my browser settings and "enable push", "enbable MDS push", and "enable wap push" are all checked. Are these the default settings, or does this mean they are checking me out!
    No, not neccesarily. When I said most traffic was pushed through the MDS by default, what I meant was even if you switch over to using the carriers browser/network (if not locked out by policies) many things can cause the device to switch traffic back through the BES. You can set it to prompt you before switching (again if you're allowed to modify the settings) try searching for "prompt mds" in the forums.

    And honestly, unless you have one really bored (or really weird) BES admin... They probably couldn't care less about your traffic--unless you give them a reason to. Think about it... Do you have time to sort through your own emails PLUS about another 4-5000 a day? But again... All depends on the company, the industry, etc.

    We have a 3-rd party app which scans ALL message traffic... It is mainly a spam/fraud detection suite, but in about 4 clicks I can read and scan by keyword every single message coming in and out. But again... Why would I want to?

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    Re: Is it possible to use BES and still get POP3 email?

    Does this mean that BES has an SMS gateway built into it? If not, I am wondering how it processes (sends) the SMS after it potentially reads it.

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    Re: Is it possible to use BES and still get POP3 email?

    Quote Originally Posted by PwDiamond
    No, not neccesarily. When I said most traffic was pushed through the MDS by default, what I meant was even if you switch over to using the carriers browser/network (if not locked out by policies) many things can cause the device to switch traffic back through the BES. You can set it to prompt you before switching (again if you're allowed to modify the settings) try searching for "prompt mds" in the forums.

    And honestly, unless you have one really bored (or really weird) BES admin... They probably couldn't care less about your traffic--unless you give them a reason to. Think about it... Do you have time to sort through your own emails PLUS about another 4-5000 a day? But again... All depends on the company, the industry, etc.

    We have a 3-rd party app which scans ALL message traffic... It is mainly a spam/fraud detection suite, but in about 4 clicks I can read and scan by keyword every single message coming in and out. But again... Why would I want to?
    Can the admin setup the BES to only log certain users SMS traffic, or does it need to be implemented (or disabled) across the entire user base?

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