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Dear All, My Boss just changed his 8700c to a new Curve 8310. He is ... RIM Desktop Software forum

  1. #1
    stormbringer202's Avatar
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    I'll Get Fired...Help

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    Dear All,

    My Boss just changed his 8700c to a new Curve 8310. He is not good with applications so asked me to install the Desktop Software. His service is on BIS.

    I can only manage to synch his contacts, calender and task and the default is for MS Outlook. I cannot seem to synch/reconcile his emails.

    I read that reconciliation is not possible with BIS and i called his service provider and the support guy also says the same thing. However my boss says his old 8700 can sync his email messages?? He was using the same service before.

    Guys help me in this;

    1. Could I synch email messages using BIS and the desktop software Ver 4.2.2

    2. If it is only one way reconcile how do i do that?

    3. In the installation of the desktop software, the button for synching messages is not active and cannot be chosen (i could choose options for calendar, tasks, etc)

    This is crucial for me as I need this job, please help. I have to provide answers to this guy by this Saturday. (we work on weekends)

    Kind regards

    Nick.
    Last edited by stormbringer202; 05-15-2008 at 11:39 AM. Reason: typos

  2. #2
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    Hi Nick,

    Just to be sure we are all on the same page, when you state that you want to sync email messages, etc, EXACTLY what do you want to accomplish?

    Do you need to add his email account to his device? Load older emails?

    I suggest that you start with desktop manager using the Switch Device Wizard. It will duplicate most settings on the new device and even load the current emails.

    Whatever the 8700 was doing we can get the 8310 to do..just need a bit more info.
    Last edited by GaryF; 05-15-2008 at 12:28 PM.
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  3. #3
    stormbringer202's Avatar
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    Hi Gary,

    Thanks for your input, really appreciate it.

    My boss uses his Curve to compose and send emails. He goes back to the office and he wants to hook up the cable and sync to the desktop manager and wants the email he had written or received on his Curve to be replicated in his Outlook.
    Gary, is this possible?

    He also wants the emails on his Outlook to be replicated on his Curve. (is this possible too?...i know it is in BES)

    He does not want the old emails of earlier...just recent ones.

    I have done earlier using the Switch Wizard but it still does not reconcile the emails.

    Thanks again Gary..

    Rgds.

  4. #4
    shmengie's Avatar
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    stormbringer: the kind of syncing your boss wants is not possible with bis, only bes. (also with activesync for ms stuff). it's unfortunate that your boss is putting you in the position of having to do the impossible because he can't remember details correctly.
    2 is not equal to 3, not even for large values of 2.
    - Grabel's Law

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    GaryF's Avatar
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    Unfortunately I believe that shmengie is correct.

    What can you tell us about the email account and the current set with the 8700? Can you test this sent email reconciliation? Also you mentioned you installed the desktop software, do you mean you installed Desktop Manager or just set the sync settings? Also can you confirm the type of email account (OWA, POP, IMAP)?
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    good point, gary. if it's imap, it reconciles itself with needing to 'dock.' and, in checking the settings, i am able to recreate sb202's settings in DM of have 'reconcile messages' greyed out when bis is active.

    sb202: maybe point your boss to this thread so he knows that you're trying and that it just isn't possible with bis.
    2 is not equal to 3, not even for large values of 2.
    - Grabel's Law

  7. #7
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    Yeah, BTSC indicates that certain IMAP and OWA will save sent messages from the BB to the service (no mention of sent messages from the desktop) Also there is mention of sent message reconciliation with redirector (which I am not real familiar with).

    But I have the same grayed out options on my destkop manager. Here is what i found on the matter:

    Reconcile messages option is grayed out by default on the BlackBerry Desktop Manager
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    Well, my sent items are stored in my IMAP platform.

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    shmengie's Avatar
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    good find, gary. that is, in fact, the deal, as we suspected...
    2 is not equal to 3, not even for large values of 2.
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    Guys,

    Thank you for all your kind input.

    Here's what i plan to do on this Saturday and will this forum posted;

    1. Change the installation to BES. This will remove the grayed section for the message synch. It could be that my Boss subscribed to BES after all since he could synch before using the 8700. I cannot find out the type of service now since the service provider is not within the same country (they are in Dubai, Im in Saudi Arabia)

    2. If it is indeed BIS, I will attempt the work around noted by the BLackberry support site. The URL kindly given by GaryF in the above thread.

    I will keep u guys posted of events.

    Once again, my eternal gratitude to every one. Im proud to be a member of this site.

    Nick.

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    Glad you enjoy the site! Can you please help us with our gas prices here in the US? I'm about to vomit lol

    But good luck with your dilemna!
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  12. #12
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    OK, first TWO thing needs to be made clear.

    First, BlackBerry NEVER Synchronizes - it RECONCILES. It may sound like semantics, but there is a big difference. Good or Exchange ActiveSync synchronize - that is what's on your device is a duplicate of what's in your mailbox. NO BlackBerry does that no matter what the setup is - even with BES. With a BlackBerry, emails are sent to the device ONCE, and never sent again.

    Second, Outlook is NOT your Email - it is a COPY of your email. Your email resides on a Mail Server. Depending on how Outlook is set up, it may or may not delete messages on the server when it retrieves them, but email doesn't "go to" Outlook - it copies it down from the server. If you're using a Web based email system like Yahoo or Gmail, you'll never see emails sent from Outlook on the (SMTP) server (Web interface) because it doesn't put a copy there. (It does when it's connected to an Exchange server.)

    Now, to the question at hand. How BIS handles emails sent from the BlackBerry depends on the MAIL SERVICE. With my Yahoo (Mail Plus) account, I used to need a filter to redirect incoming emails to a SentBB folder or they'd end up in my Inbox. That changed at some point, and now they end up in my Sent Items (and I get my Yahoo mail almost instantly, and my Yahoo email icon is different than the other BIS accounts I have set up and has a Y). I don't know if this holds true for standard Yahoo accounts.

    With GMail, I just discovered that if you have set it up with IMAP, you do NOT get your sent items. However, I just deleted the account and set it back up as a standard SMTP (Web) account, and now emails sent from my BlackBerry go to my Sent Mail folder as they used to before I changed it to IMAP. However, it still needs a Filter on the BIS setup to NOT forward emails FROM the account to the BlackBerry.

    Now, depending on the service AND the client (I assume), you may or may not get those sent emails in the client. I use Outlook Express (less and less) for my client, and with Yahoo I do NOT get a copy of the emails I send from my BlackBerry because they're redirected to a folder OE can't see. If I used a filter on the BIS setup and let them go to my Inbox, OE would pull them into my Drafts folder (!). With GMail, OE actually created a Sent folder and pulls them in (I assume since they're not redirected).

    So where does that leave you? Again, depending on the service and filtering, and RULES set up in Outlook, your boss should be seeing emails sent from his BlackBerry in his Outlook WITHOUT SYNCING! The only thing you can NOT get is emails sent from Outlook on your BlackBerry. That can only be done with BES (and possibly the Desktop Redirector - but I'm not sure).

    So why do people set up email sync? Syncing email RECONCILES Moves and Deletes.

    Even with BES, the BlackBerry will not delete email it doesn't know about. For example, I'm on a BES. If an email comes in and I move it to a PST or a folder that isn't being reconciled on my BlackBerry, it will NOT be removed from my BlackBerry. This is a conservative "I didn't see that email move (or where it moved to), so I'm not going to delete it" approach. However, if I reconcile my email WIRED with Desktop Manager, it can see the message no longer exists, so it will remove it from the BlackBerry. DM can also monitor ONE PST.

    There is a whole other kind of setup, but it requires a computer running Outlook and DM 24x7 - a poor man's BES setup - which uses the Desktop Redirector, but that is a kludgey setup at best, and prone to failure at the worst possible times (isn't it always?), so I'd avoid it.

    Test the email account in question and see how it's handling sent items. They SHOULD be getting to the Mailbox. Find out why Outlook isn't getting them.

    Sorry this was so long. Hope it helps!
    .
    JerryD

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    Quote Originally Posted by jdellasala View Post
    OK, first TWO thing needs to be made clear.

    First, BlackBerry NEVER Synchronizes - it RECONCILES. It may sound like semantics, but there is a big difference. Good or Exchange ActiveSync synchronize - that is what's on your device is a duplicate of what's in your mailbox. NO BlackBerry does that no matter what the setup is - even with BES. With a BlackBerry, emails are sent to the device ONCE, and never sent again.

    Second, Outlook is NOT your Email - it is a COPY of your email. Your email resides on a Mail Server. Depending on how Outlook is set up, it may or may not delete messages on the server when it retrieves them, but email doesn't "go to" Outlook - it copies it down from the server. If you're using a Web based email system like Yahoo or Gmail, you'll never see emails sent from Outlook on the (SMTP) server (Web interface) because it doesn't put a copy there. (It does when it's connected to an Exchange server.)

    Now, to the question at hand. How BIS handles emails sent from the BlackBerry depends on the MAIL SERVICE. With my Yahoo (Mail Plus) account, I used to need a filter to redirect incoming emails to a SentBB folder or they'd end up in my Inbox. That changed at some point, and now they end up in my Sent Items (and I get my Yahoo mail almost instantly, and my Yahoo email icon is different than the other BIS accounts I have set up and has a Y). I don't know if this holds true for standard Yahoo accounts.

    With GMail, I just discovered that if you have set it up with IMAP, you do NOT get your sent items. However, I just deleted the account and set it back up as a standard SMTP (Web) account, and now emails sent from my BlackBerry go to my Sent Mail folder as they used to before I changed it to IMAP. However, it still needs a Filter on the BIS setup to NOT forward emails FROM the account to the BlackBerry.

    Now, depending on the service AND the client (I assume), you may or may not get those sent emails in the client. I use Outlook Express (less and less) for my client, and with Yahoo I do NOT get a copy of the emails I send from my BlackBerry because they're redirected to a folder OE can't see. If I used a filter on the BIS setup and let them go to my Inbox, OE would pull them into my Drafts folder (!). With GMail, OE actually created a Sent folder and pulls them in (I assume since they're not redirected).

    So where does that leave you? Again, depending on the service and filtering, and RULES set up in Outlook, your boss should be seeing emails sent from his BlackBerry in his Outlook WITHOUT SYNCING! The only thing you can NOT get is emails sent from Outlook on your BlackBerry. That can only be done with BES (and possibly the Desktop Redirector - but I'm not sure).

    So why do people set up email sync? Syncing email RECONCILES Moves and Deletes.

    Even with BES, the BlackBerry will not delete email it doesn't know about. For example, I'm on a BES. If an email comes in and I move it to a PST or a folder that isn't being reconciled on my BlackBerry, it will NOT be removed from my BlackBerry. This is a conservative "I didn't see that email move (or where it moved to), so I'm not going to delete it" approach. However, if I reconcile my email WIRED with Desktop Manager, it can see the message no longer exists, so it will remove it from the BlackBerry. DM can also monitor ONE PST.

    There is a whole other kind of setup, but it requires a computer running Outlook and DM 24x7 - a poor man's BES setup - which uses the Desktop Redirector, but that is a kludgey setup at best, and prone to failure at the worst possible times (isn't it always?), so I'd avoid it.

    Test the email account in question and see how it's handling sent items. They SHOULD be getting to the Mailbox. Find out why Outlook isn't getting them.

    Sorry this was so long. Hope it helps!
    Wow that was very helpful. A lot of informative information. Thanks

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