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    Delfim's Avatar
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    Article: Steve Jobs And The Death Of America

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    dushdavj's Avatar
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    A very thoughtful article Del. The question is what is the solution. The problem seems to be worldwide
    . The people occupying Wall Street are making a statement but what are they asking for? The people you see supporting them, like Russel Simons, and Michael More are multi millionaires, probably have thousands of Shares on Wall Street, so what are they demonstrating on? America is a strange country, they campaign 2 yrs before elections, likely to spend more than a billion dollars before the election. No wonder their in a mess, Europe isn't any better. America needs a strong leader that will bring the parties together so that they will be able to govern

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    " Meanwhile, America's largest employer, Walmart, which employs more than 1% of working American adults, pays most of these folks about $8-$12 an hour. And those folks, of course, are lucky to have jobs: With the unemployment rate where it is, many Americans are no longer working at all"

    What's not said or reported is that many new hires (say since the first of the year) at many retailers are getting only 6-12 hours a week. Some only get 4. This is part-time. Good luck finding full-time work at our largest employer. Its an employers market, they can hire (to boost image etc) but fail to actually give workers enough hours to make a meaningful dent in their living expenses. Don't be fooled when you watch the news and hear Toys r Us, Walmart, Kohl's, and Target are hiring for the holidays. They will hire, and offer only few hours. Yes some is better than none, but its not really helping.

    I know all this all too well. Yes I have 2 neat toys, one I won here and another thanks to a generous family friend. There's a reason I didn't post for 2 years, simply couldn't afford to. And I'm not alone.

    Emergency Food Bank visits are up, its not just the (unfortunate folks) ones that come to mind traditionally visiting. Look around, odds are you know someone that has had to seek food. Foreclosures, repossessions are up. Yes I'll admit some folks spend more than they make, but the sad fact is that people who were once financially stable are now in very serious financial conditions.

    Many can't afford basic medical insurance. Some can't afford to feed themselves AND their families. Some have to choose between dinner and gas to look for a job.

    This article sums it up. We are a country that has a few (comparatively) wealthy and many (and growing) that are borderline poverty or living right on the edge. Yet we pretend we've got a handle on it. News channels hit and miss, and unless you're Warren Buffett then few in the government care if you live or die. Seriously, I'm not playing Chicken Little....the sky is falling. My Senator would rather argue party line and bicker like a schoolgirl over popularity than actually do something constructive. Sadly, We The People just grumble a bit and let it continue.

    I doubt today (in our current environment) Steve Jobs and Wozniak could do what they accomplished 30 years ago. As the article covers, that is sad, and unlikely to change anytime soon. Not unless you already have a bankroll to build it on anyway.

    Sorry guys, I'll climb down from the soapbox now. This is a subject that hits too damn close to home anymore. After searching a year for a job, getting 8,000 behind in support (and having the State label me deadbeat because I can't pay), finally getting a job that pays not nearly enough to cover gas and food, I'm left frustrated and disillusioned with anything related to the American Dream.

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    What you state in your post Jay is the essence of feelings that are rampant in the EU as well. We hear everyday of some major industry closing down (Nokia in Romania just last week) due " to lack of sales and productivity". BS ! Since Romania has entered the EU and are governed by EU standards (almost all) these companies, large and small just move elsewhere (Far East) where there is no labor control or labor corporate consciousness or responsibility and wages are dismal and the work hours long and endless. Here in Portugal its the same thing. Once prosperous manufacturing factories have relocated. And we have an exploding population of Chinese migrants coming into the country and they ONLY sell their products from China. Our open capitalist society permits that. Theirs don't.
    Sad affair. Which brings to my mind this thought:
    "Not ever, historically, and since feudal times, have so many millions labored for so few."
    That's mine. It's original.

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    Not even asking for permission, added to signature. Due credit of course.

    Watching the news now about protests on Wall Street. Its been called "unamerican" by a potential Presidential candidate. Funny I thought protests like this were one of the things our country was founded on. Peaceful protests are unamerican?

    God HELP America.

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    Unamerican, same comment as made about the Tea Party. Americas a mess. I know too many people that are doing 2 or 3 jobs to make ends meet. I had to move countries to keep a job, had to do this a number of times in my career. I personally don't think the occupy wall street protest will go very far as the people there have lots of different reasons for being there. It would be better to occupy the House, the Senate and the White House and make them all do what they were elected for, to govern to work together and forget about worrying if they are going to get re-elected but instead pass some laws, make banks loan money again so businesses can start to hire people can start buying houses, so more houses will be built and more people will be employed which will put more money into the economy by having jobs people will have money to spend. More people working will also increase the amount of tax coming in, which if the government looks into spending the money as if it was their own rather than somebody elses the debt will start to come down. People need jobs! People should be trained for new jobs and be paid enough to be able to live whilst they are being trained. The longer a person is out of work the more difficult it is to get back into the work force, yet no-one in the government seems to want to address this other than adding rhetoric and making nice speeches.

    The gap between the haves and havenots caused revolution in Russia, China and France...will it happen again? I somehow doubt it people do need to understand that this is a problem caused by both parties and despite both parties having ideas on how to fix it they are to far apart to be able to negotiate an answer. You read the blogs and people discuss the same speech but hear totally different meaning. Why is America so divided? Why is so much vitriol written?

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    I'm not wanting to sound pessimistic. Dejá-vu is more appropriate.
    The 1920-30 era is indicative, and a prelude of what was about to happen. Then and now the fight and revolt was the same. Then, the people wanted a fix which led to the choice of leaders that promised the end of the problem. The US chose the democratic way with the Master Plan. Europe, always centred upon itself and looking at its own belly-button elected (yes elected !) Adolf Hitler, Mussolini, Franco and Salazar and other nationalistic and new order fascists.
    The UK's actual stance is reminiscent of the time as well with Neville Chamberlain. Let's wait and see... Sarkozy is playing a hypocritical 2nd fiddle to Merkel just like Paul Doumer did at the time. And so on and so forth.
    Our generation has lived well. Our kids and our grand children will have serious problems.

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    the best way to predict the future is to create it

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    Quote Originally Posted by MHlousek View Post
    the best way to predict the future is to create it
    1st welcome to pinstack. 2nd don't let my reply discourage you from posting again
    That's far far easier said then done. Its nothing more than a line at the end of an inspirational poster.

    To change our financial issues will take workers as a whole standing up and saying "Enough". I just don't think we are there yet. Our government is all talk and little action, even the ones that claim they AREZ about action. Take a Senator and force him to live hand to mouth fir a year before he can serve. Make a President live in his car instead of a big mansion. Face it, our government has no real clue what its like, and has more desire for power than to make the people who elected them lives better. Yes yes as a country we are living better than say some 3rd world country. We are not living as we should. The richest country in the world and 9% of our work force cannot find MEANINGFUL GAINFUL employment.

    I don't want handouts. I don't want freebies. I am able and willing and intelligent enough to do more than dig a ditch. I'm not alone either.

    Si pray tell how do I, Jay Cooley, change the future? I have no bankroll to start a company. My credit is **** after a year of unemployment so no bank will touch me. I can't run for office, and if I did would one lone voice against what we have now be heard?

    The only way anything will change is if the country finally hits rock bottom. If We The People finally see that election promises are like farts in the wind, and the true leader of our country is the desire fir power and dollars.

    What we need is another Boston Tea Party. A real one.

    Alas, CNN would find someone to say how unamerican it would be........

    /rant.

    P.S., seriously, welcome to pinstack.

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    This is a very difficult issue. If we look back in history as Del mentions, back to the last major problem in Europe when Fascists were elected, the situation was very different to today. It happened not long after the Great War, the allies (victors) had put crippling sanctions on Germany that together with inflation that went through the roof, provided Adolf Hitler an opening, he spoke well and stirred up the masses, finding a scapegoat to blame everything on. Once elected he had no qualms in killing (literally) the opposition, then started building roads, creating employment building the armed forces etc. people began to see prosperity which with the propaganda machine running at full pelt gave him what he wanted, the rest of Europe let him do it because they were scared of going into another war, although eventually it did lead to the Second World War. America on the other hand did go down the democratic route, but they were not in anywhere near as big a financial crisis as Europe, having only spent 2 years in the Great War, and of course did not have any fighting in their country which left them a lot better off.
    If we go further back to the original Boston Tea Party, there were many causes that led to this, but in the end it was against a foreign power so again very easy to rally people against it. In addition many of the citizens had grievances against the British due to religious persecution, taxation, etc. So again it was enough to cause people to rise up.
    What is happening today is more subtle. Jobs are a major issue and as Jay states there is nothing to help an individual to get back on their feet. I know people don’t want handouts, but what they do want is jobs. When President Obama was elected he had the opportunity to concentrate and getting America working again, he had a majority in both House and the Senate to support him. Unfortunately he concentrated on the health care bill, which while it was a very noble and pressing requirement, it was probably not the most urgent issue to be solved. Today we have CNN, MSNBC, FOX, ABC and all the other news channels all reporting the news with their own special slant, some trying to rally the “troops” behind the democrats and demonize big business and millionaires (could this be trying to find a scapegoat?). The unfortunate thing is, is that we need these businesses and millionaires to create the jobs, they should be working with the government to do so. Whether these jobs are in education, green energy, the oil business, Walmart, McDonalds etc doesn’t matter, get people working then raise the minimum wage. Those who were elected to govern should start doing so and stop trying to get re-elected in 2 years time and that goes for the senators, congressmen, and governors who either want to be President, or want to stay in their current jobs. Jay is right let them try living like the rest of us for a while.
    Love is better than anger. Hope is better than fear. Optimism is better than despair. So let us be loving, hopeful, and optimistic. And we will change the world. - Jack Layton (1950-2011)
    Blackberry PlayBook 64GB Nokia 1020, Microsoft Surface PRO 2

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    Re-reading that I sound like a nut.
    I love my country and recognize the benifits we have living here. Just think its BS that we can't get work. I'm seriously thinking I have to put the ministry on hold because I will have to pull 2, 3 jobs just to stay where we are at. Just can't afford it. Sadly I know I'm not nearly as bad off as others, and it pains me that there's not much hope for those folks.

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    Another difference nowadays is the fact that there is not much a worker can do without some sort of higher education. Before manufacturing (and even call center) jobs were outsourced, people without post-secondary education (some who even were high school dropouts) could find jobs with decent pay.

    Nowadays, just about anything other than minimum wage jobs require college or advanced training of some sort. For example, plumbers, barbers, hairstylists, carpenters, auto mechanics, etc. all require training beyond high school.

    The less educated people do not have the ability to get much of any decent paying jobs. Even Apple would not hire a college dropout like Steve Jobs nowadays.
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    Laura

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